> # Re: Dorsal Slit for Phimotic Ring with Frenulum Breve and Veins

> Written by michael at 24 Jul 2000 06:20:56:

> As an answer to: Re: Dorsal Slit for Phimotic Ring with Frenulum Breve and Veins written by R J Knight at 22 Jul 2000 20:02:40:

> Thank you for your response R.J. Sorry if I seem to have overly complicated
> my situation. I should summarize by saying that I had been given a cream containing .05% betamethasone that a urologist suggested that I try. He said that I might very well experience a little tearing/bleeding as I try to pull back the foreskin. This seemed a bit counter intuitive. I imagined some micro-scaring could develop, partly defeating the objective of elastic stretching.
> I'd go along with the have pain - get gains philosophy if it wasn't for this
> ridge of tissue at the tip of the underside of the glans. I am guessing that
> this is part of the frenulum with its point of attachment way too far up the
> glans than it should be. So basically I feel if I trying the foreskin pullback
> methods too earnestly, then I am going to quickly tear at the frenulum. My primary question really is how can urologist/surgeon can make the least invasive cuts into both the phimotic tissue and the frenulum, so that desired
> pleasure nerve function and vascular blood flow levels are maintained in that area. In this connection I was surprised that a second urologist which I consulted ( he's smart enough to have taught at a med school) was not familiar
> with any way to inspect the tissue involvement without pulling back the foreskin. So you begin to see we may have a catch-22 sort of dilema. Are, or is any reader, aware of medical illustrations (clearly) showing the frenulum breve or phimotic ring. It seems that the different specialists which I have seen are
> unfamilar with these terms. Thanks to all who read this for shedding light on these and my previous (as yet)unanswered questions.
> >Michael, it seems to me that you (and some of your midwestern urologist friends) are making what is essentially a fairly simple problem into something a lot more complicated than it needs to be. First off, your question about zippers reminds me of a story that was told on a man in Atlanta some years ago. He had married a Jewish lady and to please her had converted to her faith. There were two posh clubs in Atlanta, one with gentile members only, the other one with Jewish members only. The story was that at the time of his circumcision he had a zipper installed so that he could zip on his foreskin when he went to the gentile club, to which he already belonged, and zip it off when he went to the Jewish club, which he joined after his conversion. I met him once when he was quite old, but didn't ask him to confirm the story. (I seriously doubt that it's true.)
> > You ask about why the dorsal slit is where it is, and how it affects the frenulum. Placed at the top of the penis as it is, the slit does not affect the frenulum, which normally is located at the very bottom of the penis. You ask about the slit's affect on appearance, etc. The slit need not be very long as a rule, just long enough to relieve the tight foreskin so it can be easily retracted. I know a man born in Washington State who had such a tiny snippet made at the time of his birth. The result was that it was impossible to tell him from any other uncircumcised man, but his foreskin was totally free and easily retracted. Since you have lived 42 years without circumcision, it might be a bit of a shock to you to do it at this time, but it seems highly likely that a short dorsal slit could eliminate the tightness of the foreskin without having any other perceptible effect. Certainly there's no point in your putting up with uncomfortable sex any longer (and we haven't mentioned your long-suffering wife's right to having a clean phallus thrust into her vagina during sex!). If you can find a conservative, sympathetic physician who isn't circumcision-happy but is willing to make a minimal slit at the top of your penis, you may eliminate all your problems in short order. The frenulum may not be involved at all; however, if it is found to be part of the problem, the conservative, sympathetic physician should be able to snip it with minimal trauma, followed by rapid recovery. Letters like yours make me wonder at how much some men have to put up with, and at the questionable help they sometimes receive from the medical profession. I wouldn't contact the newspapers about this at all; at best they may think you're some kind of nut instead of a citizen with a valid problem, which I accept that you are. I suggest you keep looking for a competent doctor who is willing to help you. There really are such people, and you can find one if you search diligently and are lucky! Best wishes, Bob.
> >>I've pretty much read all the previous conversations and am trying to put it
> >>all together. Here we have the human penis that comes with this sort of pro-
> >>tective glove which for most fellows is retractable past the glans (head) of
> >>the penis, if it hasn't already been cut back for any along a wide gamut of
> >>cultural reasons. Those who retain this retractable skin I would guess have
> >>long since learned to dutifully carry out some form of regular cleaning
> >>operation. But those of us (a wee tiny minority) without this blessing of
> >>retractability may possibly never entertained any notion of cleaning the
> >>phallus anywhere but on the outside. It's like one of the writers somewhere
> >>(maybe a differnt web site)wrote that he kind of likened what was visible
> >>(the reddish tip) within the hollow of a small foreskin opening, to one's
> >>eyeball. You don't go about washing the eyeball, and little more does one
> >>address the eyelids - the whole area being so delicate. The inside tip of
> >>my penis seemed like something to be left alone - it didn't seem constructed
> >>to tamper with. I assummed that with normal exterior washing the rest would
> >>somehow naturally take care of itself (think of how the ear canal, eyes, and
> >>nose are to a large extent self cleaning);indeed I have never had infections
> >>in 42 years (chlorinated pool H20 helped during years of swimming helped?)
> >>I have fathered 3 boys (all circumcised I must say) so the procreative pur-
> >>pose of the old oak tree has not been in question, though there has always
> >>been minor discomfort in the initial stage of sex - trying to actually make
> >>it inside the vagina cause if the tightness at the penis tip. But once my
> >>wife's own tightness gives way and lubrication begins then we are good to go
> >>(heh,heh) I often reflect on the similarities to my most early sexual unions
> >>because of this element of preventative-like restriction. It's one of the
> >>things that keeps me young of mind in a strange way. But now I am kind of
> >>at a stage where I want to experience what added joys and pleasure may be
> >>experienced with a fully exposed glans - that's right folks I am looking
> >>forward to going for it !! This brings me finally (almost)to my questions.
> >>I have experimented somewhat, and can manage to pull the foreskin back only
> >>far enough to expose a structure about half the tip of your little finger -
> >>that's it - without any pain. At that point there seems to be my first clue
> >>about this frenulum that is supposed to attach the foreskin to some portion
> >>of the glans (to the sulcus?). There seems to be a little ridge of skin
> >>involved right there at the tip and I get the distinct impression that this
> >>frenulum affair is quickly going to prevent my being able to pull back the
> >>foreskin much farther at all. It just really seems to tug up around there
> >>giving a pain to about the same degree as that from pressing a pretty sharp
> >>fingernail into the palm of your hand with a few pounds of force. It is this
> >>pain I feel in the first stage of sex. Pulling it tight like that makes
> >>evident what possibly is this infamous phimotic ring. It basically appears a
> >>little more "reinforced" right at the actual foreskin fold. It is about there
> >>too, under the extra pressure exerted in my little retraction attempt, that I
> >>see quite a lot of vein work. So my questions arenow these:
> >>1) Can these various cortisone creams, while somehow thinning out the foreskin,
> >> have a bad effect on the appreciable vascular network so closely involved ?
> >>2) Can these creams have any loosening or stretching effect on the frenulum ?
> >>3) If a dorsal slit is perfomed to create a relief mechanism to help facilitate
> >> retraction, how is it possible to avoid compromising the frenulum (which I
> >> understand is so chocked full of pleasure nerves, and should be respected at
> >> all costs (For after all, we here in the states may feel entitled to the
> >> pursuit of happiness, you know).
> >>4) Is the slit often made in the dorsal area since the resulting loose tissue
> >> flaps (ostensibly undesirable in appearance) would be less apparent when the
> >> penis hangs in its flaccid state ?
> >>5) Is it within the realm of common sense that the relief cut is normally
> >> made in a dorsal location so that if the frenulum is involved it can be
> >> snipped a bit there so that now all little flaps are simply in a single
> >> area.
> >>6) What is that frenuplasty (I know my spelling is way off here but I can't go
> >> back to check the right way at his point) procedure? I mean is there some
> >> real room for minimalism here (where you can barely notice operative cuts
> >> etc.). Or some creativity in the snipping and stitching that may be involved?
> >>7) Given the fact that the glans itself is covered with some kind of mucosal-
> >> like tissue, how do you get this helmet-like protuberance willing to exist
> >> in the cruel abrasive environment - open hair, rough clothes, etc. - for the
> >> first time in over 40 years ?
> >>8) (6) and (7) having been asked, is there any possibility in this fantastic
> >> technologically miraculous age of ours to install a very thin micro-zipper
> >> so that one could unzip ones foreskin zipper either for sex or for washing
> >> than zip back up? Thus any flaps that may have been a bit unsightly can
> >> be justed zipped shut. Sorta keep the skin fully intact (have cake and eat
> >> it too, if you will)
> >>9) Have any the visitors reading the dialogue in this section, had any
> >> experience, using cream and pull-back exercises, where some ripping or
> >> tearing of the skin occurred? Did you wait for more than a day to heal
> >> up before you tried again? (Or how long?) What about any scar tissue that
> >> could then develop? At what point does elasticity begin to be so compromised
> >> that diminishing returns ensue?
> >>10) Is there any safe tool that a man can use to stretch the foreskin
> >> opening uniformly (around the the circumference) and gradually (over
> >> hours, days, weeks)? I thought I saw some such apparatus in my surfing.
> >> It definitely could make a lot of sense. Certainly there are various
> >> peoples about the world who practice various kind of skin stretching or
> >> hole expanding using some appliance over some appreciable length of time.
> >>(!!) Hey thanks for everyone's time. Please answer what questions you can.
> >> I believe they are all pretty good ones - relevant and haven't really
> >> been raised before. I have visited and tried to deal with a few Urology
> >> groups here in the U.S. midwest and I am not really getting very straight
> >> answers. I hope to arm myself with enough good ideas so that I can
> >> deal with any of medical community proactively and effectively but
> >> tactfully as well. I had conjured up a few notions of documenting my
> >> efforts, in a way that could foster enlightenment. I did call the local
> >> paper at one point but they are not quite ready to bite. So please supply
> >> your best ideas, piecemeal or comprehensively in your responses which I
> >> very greatly appreciate, and look forward to applying towards the pleasures
> >> of lovemaking and providing a decent follow-up here in good time(Thanks).
> >>

> Answers:

> - Re: Dorsal Slit for Phimotic Ring with Frenulum Breve and Veins R J Knight 7/24/2000 18:27 (0)

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